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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Betfair punters now make it a 66% chance that Trump will survi

SystemSystem Posts: 5,841
edited April 13 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Betfair punters now make it a 66% chance that Trump will survive his first term

After a quite dramatic week in US politics during which there has been a raid on the law firm that advises the President there has been a slight decline on the betting markets on weather Trump will serve a full first term.

Read the full story here


«134

Comments

  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 19,340
    edited April 13
    First.

    I just can't see Trump going willingly - and I think he'll stand for a second term.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 10,788
    'there has been a slight decline on the betting markets on weather Trump will serve a full first term.’

    Spell-check malfunction Boss!
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 4,425

    'there has been a slight decline on the betting markets on weather Trump will serve a full first term.’

    Spell-check malfunction Boss!

    Thanks you for that. Fixed.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 10,788

    'there has been a slight decline on the betting markets on weather Trump will serve a full first term.’

    Spell-check malfunction Boss!

    Thanks you for that. Fixed.
    Always happy to help!
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    edited April 13
    I think it depends if they do have something highly compromising what it is.

    I am not sure evidence of previous dodgy dealings in real estate (just like previous stories of bonking Porn Stars) will make much difference, as they are pretty much factored in to who TheDonald is.

    They need to have him, and him personally, doing something very dodgy with the Russians in relation to the election.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 17,423
    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.
  • Torby_FennelTorby_Fennel Posts: 190


    Thanks you for that. Fixed.

    Not really... it says "wheher" now. ;)
  • volcanopetevolcanopete Posts: 1,922
    Trump is up to his neck in urine and he might just drown in it.Alternatively,I guess a CIA hit-job.Either way,I'm tempted to back against the curve.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 7,247
    Sandpit said:

    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.

    There will not be 67 Democrats in the Senate after the midterms.

    There's an easy statement to make for once.

    The question is whether the ems would force it through the house knowing it wouldn't be passed in the Senate.
  • ElliotElliot Posts: 980

    Trump is up to his neck in urine and he might just drown in it.Alternatively,I guess a CIA hit-job.Either way,I'm tempted to back against the curve.

    He can drown in it but still survive until 2020. Republicans are as pathetic at standing up for principle as Labour MPs.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 7,247
    I took my money on this market. It's effectively 10% per year from here on in.
  • ElliotElliot Posts: 980
    Sandpit said:

    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.

    That's an impossibility. Only eight Republicans are up, and the Democrats currently have 49 seats. So even if they won every seat, including against popular incumbents in Nebraska and Utah, they would still only have 57.

    Realistically, 52 would be an amazing achievement for them.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 17,423

    Sandpit said:

    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.

    There will not be 67 Democrats in the Senate after the midterms.

    There's an easy statement to make for once.

    The question is whether the ems would force it through the house knowing it wouldn't be passed in the Senate.
    Indeed, there’s only 8 currently Republican seats being contested in November, plus the Republican vacancy in Mississippi. So unless a load more Republican Senators resign in the next few months, Trump’s going to be safe from impeachment until 2020.

    The House may well vote to impeach - as they did with Clinton - knowing that it will stop almost everything else in Washington for a year or more and cause ructions among the Republican Party.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 7,247
    Elliot said:

    Sandpit said:

    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.

    That's an impossibility. Only eight Republicans are up, and the Democrats currently have 49 seats. So even if they won every seat, including against popular incumbents in Nebraska and Utah, they would still only have 57.

    Realistically, 52 would be an amazing achievement for them.
    Could be some more resignations/deaths.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.

    There will not be 67 Democrats in the Senate after the midterms.

    There's an easy statement to make for once.

    The question is whether the ems would force it through the house knowing it wouldn't be passed in the Senate.
    Indeed, there’s only 8 currently Republican seats being contested in November, plus the Republican vacancy in Mississippi. So unless a load more Republican Senators resign in the next few months, Trump’s going to be safe from impeachment until 2020.

    The House may well vote to impeach - as they did with Clinton - knowing that it will stop almost everything else in Washington for a year or more and cause ructions among the Republican Party.
    The democrats need to be careful not to be seen to be impeaching lightly. It will play into trump deep state / swamp / vested interests trying to stop him narrative.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 18,113
    edited April 13
    On topic: This is a really hard market to assess. We don't really have any precedent for the freak show which is the Trump presidency, his character is bizarre, the political dynamics of any impeachment attempt are tricky for both sides, and we don't know what the Feds know. It is certainly true that the legal complications for Trump's administration seem to increase almost by the day, but is that enough?

    On balance, given the numbers in the Senate and Trump's behaviour so far, my assessment would be that the market is overstating the likelihood of him going; I think I'd put it at around 10% to 15%, not 34%. However, it's not an assessment one can really make with any confidence.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 12,788

    Elliot said:

    Sandpit said:

    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.

    That's an impossibility. Only eight Republicans are up, and the Democrats currently have 49 seats. So even if they won every seat, including against popular incumbents in Nebraska and Utah, they would still only have 57.

    Realistically, 52 would be an amazing achievement for them.
    Could be some more resignations/deaths.
    Not 15 resignations.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 17,423
    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website, which says:

    Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of the United Kingdom on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the EU. This concerns in particular:
     Certificates of airworthiness, restricted certificates of airworthiness, permits to fly, approvals of organisations responsible for the maintenance of products, parts and appliances, approvals for organisations responsible for the manufacture of products, parts and appliances, approvals for maintenance training organisations, and certificates for personnel responsible for the release of a product, part or appliance after maintenance, issued pursuant to Article 5 of the Basic Regulation;
     Pilot licences, pilot medical certificates, certificates for pilot training organisations, certificates for aero-medical centres, certificates for flight simulation training devices, certificates for persons responsible for providing flight training, flight simulation training or assessing pilots' skill, and certificates for aero medical examiners, issued pursuant to Article 7 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for air operators and attestations for the cabin crew, issued pursuant to Article 8 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for aerodromes, certificates for ATM/ANS providers, licences and medical certificates for air traffic controllers, certificates for air traffic controller training organisations, certificates for aero medical centres and aero medical examiners responsible for air traffic controllers, certificates for persons
    etc
  • DecrepitJohnLDecrepitJohnL Posts: 7,754

    First.

    I just can't see Trump going willingly - and I think he'll stand for a second term.

    My money would be on a backroom deal not to stand again in return for not being slung out.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    Russia publishes a report into the Skripal Salisbury poisoning case

    It's pretty much an in-depth timeline (nearly 10,000 words) of what's happened and does not provide much, if anything, we do not already know.

    Wonder what jezza will be reading this weekend?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547

    First.

    I just can't see Trump going willingly - and I think he'll stand for a second term.

    My money would be on a backroom deal not to stand again in return for not being slung out.
    You think he will then honour that?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 17,873
    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    Project fear?
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 2,734
    edited April 13
    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website, which says:

    Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of the United Kingdom on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the EU. This concerns in particular:
     Certificates of airworthiness, restricted certificates of airworthiness, permits to fly, approvals of organisations responsible for the maintenance of products, parts and appliances, approvals for organisations responsible for the manufacture of products, parts and appliances, approvals for maintenance training organisations, and certificates for personnel responsible for the release of a product, part or appliance after maintenance, issued pursuant to Article 5 of the Basic Regulation;
     Pilot licences, pilot medical certificates, certificates for pilot training organisations, certificates for aero-medical centres, certificates for flight simulation training devices, certificates for persons responsible for providing flight training, flight simulation training or assessing pilots' skill, and certificates for aero medical examiners, issued pursuant to Article 7 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for air operators and attestations for the cabin crew, issued pursuant to Article 8 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for aerodromes, certificates for ATM/ANS providers, licences and medical certificates for air traffic controllers, certificates for air traffic controller training organisations, certificates for aero medical centres and aero medical examiners responsible for air traffic controllers, certificates for persons
    etc

    I'd be tempted to reciprocate:

    "Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of all EU countries on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the UK. This concerns in particular certificates of airworthiness ...."

    Buy shares in car ferry companies!
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521
    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website, which says:

    Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of the United Kingdom on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the EU. This concerns in particular:
     Certificates of airworthiness, restricted certificates of airworthiness, permits to fly, approvals of organisations responsible for the maintenance of products, parts and appliances, approvals for organisations responsible for the manufacture of products, parts and appliances, approvals for maintenance training organisations, and certificates for personnel responsible for the release of a product, part or appliance after maintenance, issued pursuant to Article 5 of the Basic Regulation;
     Pilot licences, pilot medical certificates, certificates for pilot training organisations, certificates for aero-medical centres, certificates for flight simulation training devices, certificates for persons responsible for providing flight training, flight simulation training or assessing pilots' skill, and certificates for aero medical examiners, issued pursuant to Article 7 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for air operators and attestations for the cabin crew, issued pursuant to Article 8 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for aerodromes, certificates for ATM/ANS providers, licences and medical certificates for air traffic controllers, certificates for air traffic controller training organisations, certificates for aero medical centres and aero medical examiners responsible for air traffic controllers, certificates for persons
    etc

    Absolute Bollocks
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 7,247

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    Project fear?
    £100 says Heathrow is not going to out of business on 1 April 2019.
  • ElliotElliot Posts: 980

    Elliot said:

    Sandpit said:

    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.

    That's an impossibility. Only eight Republicans are up, and the Democrats currently have 49 seats. So even if they won every seat, including against popular incumbents in Nebraska and Utah, they would still only have 57.

    Realistically, 52 would be an amazing achievement for them.
    Could be some more resignations/deaths.
    10 of them?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    Project fear?
    £100 says Heathrow is not going to out of business on 1 April 2019.

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    Project fear?
    I think even you know this is utter bollocks - no one is going to be grounded



  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 1,818
    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website

    Surely this is just the EU recognising that A50 implementation means that we have taken back control of our Aviation Regulation?

    One would have thought that it would have been astute to incorporate this issue in the Transition deal.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 14,120
    Floater said:
    Nonsense, he'll make a great war leader.
  • BromptonautBromptonaut Posts: 817
    Floater said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website, which says:

    Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of the United Kingdom on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the EU. This concerns in particular:
     Certificates of airworthiness, restricted certificates of airworthiness, permits to fly, approvals of organisations responsible for the maintenance of products, parts and appliances, approvals for organisations responsible for the manufacture of products, parts and appliances, approvals for maintenance training organisations, and certificates for personnel responsible for the release of a product, part or appliance after maintenance, issued pursuant to Article 5 of the Basic Regulation;
     Pilot licences, pilot medical certificates, certificates for pilot training organisations, certificates for aero-medical centres, certificates for flight simulation training devices, certificates for persons responsible for providing flight training, flight simulation training or assessing pilots' skill, and certificates for aero medical examiners, issued pursuant to Article 7 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for air operators and attestations for the cabin crew, issued pursuant to Article 8 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for aerodromes, certificates for ATM/ANS providers, licences and medical certificates for air traffic controllers, certificates for air traffic controller training organisations, certificates for aero medical centres and aero medical examiners responsible for air traffic controllers, certificates for persons
    etc

    Absolute Bollocks
    They need us more than we need them, remember?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    Floater said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website, which says:

    Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of the United Kingdom on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the EU. This concerns in particular:
     Certificates of airworthiness, restricted certificates of airworthiness, permits to fly, approvals of organisations responsible for the maintenance of products, parts and appliances, approvals for organisations responsible for the manufacture of products, parts and appliances, approvals for maintenance training organisations, and certificates for personnel responsible for the release of a product, part or appliance after maintenance, issued pursuant to Article 5 of the Basic Regulation;
     Pilot licences, pilot medical certificates, certificates for pilot training organisations, certificates for aero-medical centres, certificates for flight simulation training devices, certificates for persons responsible for providing flight training, flight simulation training or assessing pilots' skill, and certificates for aero medical examiners, issued pursuant to Article 7 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for air operators and attestations for the cabin crew, issued pursuant to Article 8 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for aerodromes, certificates for ATM/ANS providers, licences and medical certificates for air traffic controllers, certificates for air traffic controller training organisations, certificates for aero medical centres and aero medical examiners responsible for air traffic controllers, certificates for persons
    etc

    Absolute Bollocks
    They need us more than we need them, remember?
    It really isn't going to result in a shut down
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    Floater said:
    Nonsense, he'll make a great war leader.
    I'm sure Iran would love to have us alongside
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 7,247
    Elliot said:

    Elliot said:

    Sandpit said:

    Unless there’s 67 Democrats in the Senate after the mid-terms, he ain’t going anywhere.

    That's an impossibility. Only eight Republicans are up, and the Democrats currently have 49 seats. So even if they won every seat, including against popular incumbents in Nebraska and Utah, they would still only have 57.

    Realistically, 52 would be an amazing achievement for them.
    Could be some more resignations/deaths.
    10 of them?
    Not impossible, merely highly improbable
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 17,423

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    Project fear?
    No sh!t, Sherlock.

    Project Fear with knobs on, clearly not even attempting the good faith that was agreed only a couple of months ago.
  • BromptonautBromptonaut Posts: 817
    Floater said:

    Floater said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website, which says:

    Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of the United Kingdom on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the EU. This concerns in particular:
     Certificates of airworthiness, restricted certificates of airworthiness, permits to fly, approvals of organisations responsible for the maintenance of products, parts and appliances, approvals for organisations responsible for the manufacture of products, parts and appliances, approvals for maintenance training organisations, and certificates for personnel responsible for the release of a product, part or appliance after maintenance, issued pursuant to Article 5 of the Basic Regulation;
     Pilot licences, pilot medical certificates, certificates for pilot training organisations, certificates for aero-medical centres, certificates for flight simulation training devices, certificates for persons responsible for providing flight training, flight simulation training or assessing pilots' skill, and certificates for aero medical examiners, issued pursuant to Article 7 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for air operators and attestations for the cabin crew, issued pursuant to Article 8 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for aerodromes, certificates for ATM/ANS providers, licences and medical certificates for air traffic controllers, certificates for air traffic controller training organisations, certificates for aero medical centres and aero medical examiners responsible for air traffic controllers, certificates for persons
    etc

    Absolute Bollocks
    They need us more than we need them, remember?
    It really isn't going to result in a shut down
    Spanish hoteliers going to march on Brussels?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    edited April 13
    https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2018/apr/13/ive-been-an-nhs-doctor-for-five-years-the-home-office-wants-to-deport-me

    While the decision seems unfair, I do wonder why a) he left it so late and b) who would think that there wouldn't be a problem (at very least not check) in leaving it so late that your visa will have expired by the time you are to be processed.

    There seems to be a lot of people who think hey they don't really take visas seriously in the uk and will sort it whenever.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 17,423
    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website

    Surely this is just the EU recognising that A50 implementation means that we have taken back control of our Aviation Regulation?

    One would have thought that it would have been astute to incorporate this issue in the Transition deal.
    It even includes doctors, who earn a small fortune doing medicals for the long list of aviation professionals listed.

    Yes, I’m expecting this all to be resolved before we leave the EU, but publishing such scaremongering documents is clearly not even attempting good faith in negotiations.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 1,818
    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website

    Surely this is just the EU recognising that A50 implementation means that we have taken back control of our Aviation Regulation?

    One would have thought that it would have been astute to incorporate this issue in the Transition deal.
    It even includes doctors, who earn a small fortune doing medicals for the long list of aviation professionals listed.

    Yes, I’m expecting this all to be resolved before we leave the EU, but publishing such scaremongering documents is clearly not even attempting good faith in negotiations.
    Until it has been agreed and signed off, it is a simple matter of fact that current rules will no longer apply. It is the price of Sovereignty.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 1,818

    https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2018/apr/13/ive-been-an-nhs-doctor-for-five-years-the-home-office-wants-to-deport-me

    While the decision seems unfair, I do wonder why a) he left it so late and b) who would think that there wouldn't be a problem (at very least not check) in leaving it so late that your visa will have expired by the time you are to be processed.

    There seems to be a lot of people who think hey they don't really take visas seriously in the uk and will sort it whenever.

    It is all part of May's "Hostile Environment" for immigrants. Enoch would be proud, he specifically mentioned Commonwealth Doctors returning to their original nation.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    edited April 13
    Foxy said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2018/apr/13/ive-been-an-nhs-doctor-for-five-years-the-home-office-wants-to-deport-me

    While the decision seems unfair, I do wonder why a) he left it so late and b) who would think that there wouldn't be a problem (at very least not check) in leaving it so late that your visa will have expired by the time you are to be processed.

    There seems to be a lot of people who think hey they don't really take visas seriously in the uk and will sort it whenever.

    It is all part of May's "Hostile Environment" for immigrants. Enoch would be proud, he specifically mentioned Commonwealth Doctors returning to their original nation.
    I don't mean to be funny but if you get a visa to work / study in another country, you read the f##king rules and stick to them. Having had visas for us, i would never dare to think it is okay to play fast and loose and think hey whatever I will get around to it sometime like when it has expired.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 17,873
    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website

    Surely this is just the EU recognising that A50 implementation means that we have taken back control of our Aviation Regulation?

    One would have thought that it would have been astute to incorporate this issue in the Transition deal.
    It even includes doctors, who earn a small fortune doing medicals for the long list of aviation professionals listed.

    Yes, I’m expecting this all to be resolved before we leave the EU, but publishing such scaremongering documents is clearly not even attempting good faith in negotiations.
    There's a difference between good faith and blind faith. It would be negligent for them not to warn private parties of what their position in the absence of the withdrawal agreement being passed.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 9,632

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
  • RobDRobD Posts: 31,866

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    President Donald Trump on Friday pardoned former Dick Cheney chief of staff Scooter Libby, the White House said.

    Libby had been convicted of perjury in 2007 in the investigation into who leaked the identity of CIA officer Valerie Plame.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 9,632
    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    You are FU and I claim my prize
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 9,632
    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    edited April 13

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    Fake news bbc actually...its on the front page.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-43751440

    Shouldn’t you be reading the real true story of Salisbury via the Russian 10k word report?
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 17,423

    Foxy said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2018/apr/13/ive-been-an-nhs-doctor-for-five-years-the-home-office-wants-to-deport-me

    While the decision seems unfair, I do wonder why a) he left it so late and b) who would think that there wouldn't be a problem (at very least not check) in leaving it so late that your visa will have expired by the time you are to be processed.

    There seems to be a lot of people who think hey they don't really take visas seriously in the uk and will sort it whenever.

    It is all part of May's "Hostile Environment" for immigrants. Enoch would be proud, he specifically mentioned Commonwealth Doctors returning to their original nation.
    I don't mean to be funny but if you get a visa to work / study in another country, you read the f##king rules and stick to them. Having had visas for us, i would never dare to think it is okay to play fast and loose and think hey whatever I will get around to it sometime like when it has expired.
    Quite. There seems to be a huge amount of ignorance as to how these things work elsewhere in the world. Pretty much everywhere will fine you or deport you if you overstay your visa or work when not allowed to, and it will often affect your chances of getting another one.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2018/apr/13/ive-been-an-nhs-doctor-for-five-years-the-home-office-wants-to-deport-me

    While the decision seems unfair, I do wonder why a) he left it so late and b) who would think that there wouldn't be a problem (at very least not check) in leaving it so late that your visa will have expired by the time you are to be processed.

    There seems to be a lot of people who think hey they don't really take visas seriously in the uk and will sort it whenever.

    It is all part of May's "Hostile Environment" for immigrants. Enoch would be proud, he specifically mentioned Commonwealth Doctors returning to their original nation.
    I don't mean to be funny but if you get a visa to work / study in another country, you read the f##king rules and stick to them. Having had visas for us, i would never dare to think it is okay to play fast and loose and think hey whatever I will get around to it sometime like when it has expired.
    Quite. There seems to be a huge amount of ignorance as to how these things work elsewhere in the world. Pretty much everywhere will fine you or deport you if you overstay your visa or work when not allowed to, and it will often affect your chances of getting another one.
    I know people who have been put back straight back on planes when landing in the US because they have played fast and loose with their visas.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 17,423

    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website

    Surely this is just the EU recognising that A50 implementation means that we have taken back control of our Aviation Regulation?

    One would have thought that it would have been astute to incorporate this issue in the Transition deal.
    It even includes doctors, who earn a small fortune doing medicals for the long list of aviation professionals listed.

    Yes, I’m expecting this all to be resolved before we leave the EU, but publishing such scaremongering documents is clearly not even attempting good faith in negotiations.
    There's a difference between good faith and blind faith. It would be negligent for them not to warn private parties of what their position in the absence of the withdrawal agreement being passed.
    Negotiating in good faith means not threatening or scaremongering. This sort of EU publication is *EXACTLY* what we meant by that clause.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 1,818
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website

    Surely this is just the EU recognising that A50 implementation means that we have taken back control of our Aviation Regulation?

    One would have thought that it would have been astute to incorporate this issue in the Transition deal.
    It even includes doctors, who earn a small fortune doing medicals for the long list of aviation professionals listed.

    Yes, I’m expecting this all to be resolved before we leave the EU, but publishing such scaremongering documents is clearly not even attempting good faith in negotiations.
    There's a difference between good faith and blind faith. It would be negligent for them not to warn private parties of what their position in the absence of the withdrawal agreement being passed.
    Negotiating in good faith means not threatening or scaremongering. This sort of EU publication is *EXACTLY* what we meant by that clause.
    Ah well. The Red Funnel to the Wight is quicker and has a better breakfast, so try it for your Easter hols.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    There is no hope for BJO...too much koolaid I’m afraid.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    Floater said:

    Floater said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website, which says:

    Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of the United Kingdom on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the EU. This concerns in particular:
     Certificates of airworthiness, restricted certificates of airworthiness, permits to fly, approvals of organisations responsible for the maintenance of products, parts and appliances, approvals for organisations responsible for the manufacture of products, parts and appliances, approvals for maintenance training organisations, and certificates for personnel responsible for the release of a product, part or appliance after maintenance, issued pursuant to Article 5 of the Basic Regulation;
     Pilot licences, pilot medical certificates, certificates for pilot training organisations, certificates for aero-medical centres, certificates for flight simulation training devices, certificates for persons responsible for providing flight training, flight simulation training or assessing pilots' skill, and certificates for aero medical examiners, issued pursuant to Article 7 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for air operators and attestations for the cabin crew, issued pursuant to Article 8 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for aerodromes, certificates for ATM/ANS providers, licences and medical certificates for air traffic controllers, certificates for air traffic controller training organisations, certificates for aero medical centres and aero medical examiners responsible for air traffic controllers, certificates for persons
    etc

    Absolute Bollocks
    They need us more than we need them, remember?
    It really isn't going to result in a shut down
    Spanish hoteliers going to march on Brussels?
    Are you actually saying you believe our planes will be grounded?

    I don't know whether to laugh at you or cry
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 17,423

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 9,632
    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 13,219

    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website

    Surely this is just the EU recognising that A50 implementation means that we have taken back control of our Aviation Regulation?

    One would have thought that it would have been astute to incorporate this issue in the Transition deal.
    It even includes doctors, who earn a small fortune doing medicals for the long list of aviation professionals listed.

    Yes, I’m expecting this all to be resolved before we leave the EU, but publishing such scaremongering documents is clearly not even attempting good faith in negotiations.
    There's a difference between good faith and blind faith. It would be negligent for them not to warn private parties of what their position in the absence of the withdrawal agreement being passed.
    And when is the corrupt under the counter deal with Germany and Gazprom due for prosecution at the ECJ and the EU fine Germany billions and arrest those involved
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    edited April 13
    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something....I might be wrong, but I don’t even think that quote is on guido.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something.
    Big John has gone off the deep end after embracing corbynmania
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    Afghanistan? why the feck would anyone have been against Afghanistan?

    Of course the Americans with Labours help fecked it up by going into Iraq on a lie
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 9,632
    I would be interested to know what lessons FU Floater and all other war mongerers have learned from Iraq and Libya.

    I mean how many times does military intervention have to make things worse before your knees jerk over and over again??
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    Floater said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something.
    Big John has gone off the deep end after embracing corbynmania
    It’s a very sad. My neighbours kids talk more sense / grounded in reality these days, and they are all under the age of 10.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 13,195

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    edited April 13

    I would be interested to know what lessons FU Floater and all other war mongerers have learned from Iraq and Libya.

    I mean how many times does military intervention have to make things worse before your knees jerk over and over again??

    Erhhh where have I said anything about military intervention (go have a look, you will be a long time) and I was against the Iraq war...but hey facts, what are they.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 29,695
    edited April 13

    I would be interested to know what lessons FU Floater and all other war mongerers have learned from Iraq and Libya.

    I mean how many times does military intervention have to make things worse before your knees jerk over and over again??

    I don't think there's anything to be gained intervening in Syria, BJO, but it would be very silly to assume the lesson was that one should never consider it, and very unfair to conclude that if someone does come down on the other side of that very difficult decision, that they are a warmonger. No doubt some are, but never supporting something is no more a virtue than always supporting something. Each situation must be judged anew. Afghanistan is about the most successful, and that's still a clusterf**k, but are people warmongers for considering action, or traitors for not considering it? No.

    Not to mention people may have supported one but not the others.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 1,818

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something....I might be wrong, but I don’t even think that quote is on guido.
    To be fair, The Labour Party is correct. May is not likely to act without knowing what the US is planning to do, so it is a concise summary of the Government's position.
  • nielhnielh Posts: 1,052

    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2018/apr/13/ive-been-an-nhs-doctor-for-five-years-the-home-office-wants-to-deport-me

    While the decision seems unfair, I do wonder why a) he left it so late and b) who would think that there wouldn't be a problem (at very least not check) in leaving it so late that your visa will have expired by the time you are to be processed.

    There seems to be a lot of people who think hey they don't really take visas seriously in the uk and will sort it whenever.

    It is all part of May's "Hostile Environment" for immigrants. Enoch would be proud, he specifically mentioned Commonwealth Doctors returning to their original nation.
    I don't mean to be funny but if you get a visa to work / study in another country, you read the f##king rules and stick to them. Having had visas for us, i would never dare to think it is okay to play fast and loose and think hey whatever I will get around to it sometime like when it has expired.
    Quite. There seems to be a huge amount of ignorance as to how these things work elsewhere in the world. Pretty much everywhere will fine you or deport you if you overstay your visa or work when not allowed to, and it will often affect your chances of getting another one.
    I know people who have been put back straight back on planes when landing in the US because they have played fast and loose with their visas.
    To look at it another way: why are the home office spending tens of thousand pounds going through the courts trying to deport this guy, when we have just spent money training him to do a job in the NHS (GP) where there is an enormous skill shortage?

    Its just a total waste of money. He should just be given the opportunity of regularising his situation.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    edited April 13
    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something....I might be wrong, but I don’t even think that quote is on guido.
    To be fair, The Labour Party is correct. May is not likely to act without knowing what the US is planning to do, so it is a concise summary of the Government's position.
    I didn’t say it wasn’t. We always work in partnership with at least the US.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 9,632
    Floater said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    Afghanistan? why the feck would anyone have been against Afghanistan?

    Of course the Americans with Labours help fecked it up by going into Iraq on a lie
    I bet you supported all 3 though.

    And I bet you believed the WMD row
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    Floater said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something.
    Big John has gone off the deep end after embracing corbynmania
    It’s a very sad. My neighbours kids talk more sense / grounded in reality these days, and they are all under the age of 10.
    Sounds about right
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 1,818
    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
    Jezza has stated that he is not a Pacifist, he has stated that war should be the last resort, and in support of the United Nations.

  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 2,335
    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something....I might be wrong, but I don’t even think that quote is on guido.
    To be fair, The Labour Party is correct. May is not likely to act without knowing what the US is planning to do, so it is a concise summary of the Government's position.
    I wonder if idiotic smugness can be weaponised? With magic money tree finances and that as defence plan we'd be golden.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    nielh said:

    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare-network/2018/apr/13/ive-been-an-nhs-doctor-for-five-years-the-home-office-wants-to-deport-me

    While the decision seems unfair, I do wonder why a) he left it so late and b) who would think that there wouldn't be a problem (at very least not check) in leaving it so late that your visa will have expired by the time you are to be processed.

    There seems to be a lot of people who think hey they don't really take visas seriously in the uk and will sort it whenever.

    It is all part of May's "Hostile Environment" for immigrants. Enoch would be proud, he specifically mentioned Commonwealth Doctors returning to their original nation.
    I don't mean to be funny but if you get a visa to work / study in another country, you read the f##king rules and stick to them. Having had visas for us, i would never dare to think it is okay to play fast and loose and think hey whatever I will get around to it sometime like when it has expired.
    Quite. There seems to be a huge amount of ignorance as to how these things work elsewhere in the world. Pretty much everywhere will fine you or deport you if you overstay your visa or work when not allowed to, and it will often affect your chances of getting another one.
    I know people who have been put back straight back on planes when landing in the US because they have played fast and loose with their visas.
    To look at it another way: why are the home office spending tens of thousand pounds going through the courts trying to deport this guy, when we have just spent money training him to do a job in the NHS (GP) where there is an enormous skill shortage?

    Its just a total waste of money. He should just be given the opportunity of regularising his situation.
    Well that is what I said in the original post, but I was just pointing out again that people seem to think that uk visa rules are optional / don’t apply to them and then get a shock when having broken them they get a negative outcome and then guardian publishes a soft soap piece about it breezing over that they broke the rules.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    I would be interested to know what lessons FU Floater and all other war mongerers have learned from Iraq and Libya.

    I mean how many times does military intervention have to make things worse before your knees jerk over and over again??

    What I learned from Iraq was that nothing was to low for Labour to stoop to.

    Plus they were happy to send people to war without adequate stocks of pain relief (amongst other things)

    You on the other hand have ignored anti semitism and appear to have learnt nothing from history

  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521
    Foxy said:

    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
    Jezza has stated that he is not a Pacifist, he has stated that war should be the last resort, and in support of the United Nations.

    At a push he might have agreed we should have fought in WW2 - but obviously only after Russia was invaded.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 13,219

    I would be interested to know what lessons FU Floater and all other war mongerers have learned from Iraq and Libya.

    I mean how many times does military intervention have to make things worse before your knees jerk over and over again??

    BJO -

    interventions have been ill advised in the past but that does not mean all future interventions are wrong otherwise the International rules based system on WMD becomes meaningless and any state has license to gas babies, women and ordinary people.

    Russia even tried to blame the white helmets for the attack today and at the same time said there was no attack.

    I am in favour of an attack to degrade Assad's ability to produce the chemicals involved and the means of delivery, nothing else.

    If the allies and NATO decide to take action then we should support them. TM has a difficult responsibilty but if the attacks do not happen then she should put it before Parliament on monday where I would expect her to win support and at the same time fracture the labour party

    In a situation like this a stand has to be made against WMD

  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 3,526
    Am I the only one a little queasy at the mention of whether Trump will 'survive' his first term?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521

    Floater said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    Afghanistan? why the feck would anyone have been against Afghanistan?

    Of course the Americans with Labours help fecked it up by going into Iraq on a lie
    I bet you supported all 3 though.

    And I bet you believed the WMD row
    Were you against Afghanistan?

    You a troofer ?

    Reading your crap I could believe it.
  • hunchmanhunchman Posts: 2,482
    Well what a fascinating day! The government's carefully constructed propaganda over the Syrian alleged chemicals weapon attack is now falling apart rapidly at the seams:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-13/russia-has-irrefutable-evidence-uk-staged-syrian-chemical-attack

    and the wonderful former UK ambassador to Syria, Peter Ford, says the same thing:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-11/former-uk-ambassador-syria-syrian-chemical-weapons-attack-was-staged-islamic-jihadi

    The government lies to us all the time - they've lied to us over global warming, ahem man made climate change, they've lied to us about the future security of our food supplies, they've lied to us over the Panama Papers and Paradise Papers and covered up the fraud, theft and money laundering operations that many MP's and members of the House of Lords are linked to (documented fact via prima facie companies house evidence), they've lied to us the reason they got involved in Syria in the first place (in order to get gas and oil pipelines built through there from Qatar in order to reduce European dependence on Russian energy), they've lied to us about what they're doing to the NHS and they've lied to us about covering up historic child sexual abuse linked to Westminster (just have a look at the Exaro News directors apart from Mark Watts and where their fellow directorships and associated directors leads for starters).

    With a record like that, the government is the last thing I would ever trust. And a lot of the general population over the coming years are going to come to the hard realisation that you cannot trust the government, just as Eastern Europe and Russia found out the hard way with the collapse of communism in the late 1980's and early 1990's.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 29,695
    Foxy said:

    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
    Jezza has stated that he is not a Pacifist, he has stated that war should be the last resort, and in support of the United Nations.

    So no action is legitimate unless everyone with a security council veto is in agreement (or at least assents)? Doesn't that rather suggest that any of the veto holding members could act with impunity and he would never support taking action against them? Any of them? We should start invading places.

    In all seriousness though, the UN is not a perfect organisation, are there never situations in which they cannot be the avenue taken? UN members don't subcontract all foreign and military affairs to the UN.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 13,195
    Foxy said:

    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
    Jezza has stated that he is not a Pacifist, he has stated that war should be the last resort, and in support of the United Nations.

    Jezza states many things. The vast majority of which are the dribblings of a man so out of his depth that the Mariana sea trench wouldn't accommodate him.

    Jezza has never supported any military action whether humanitarian or UN sanctioned. If it quacks etc ....
  • Ishmael_ZIshmael_Z Posts: 5,271
    hunchman said:

    Well what a fascinating day! The government's carefully constructed propaganda over the Syrian alleged chemicals weapon attack is now falling apart rapidly at the seams:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-13/russia-has-irrefutable-evidence-uk-staged-syrian-chemical-attack

    and the wonderful former UK ambassador to Syria, Peter Ford, says the same thing:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-11/former-uk-ambassador-syria-syrian-chemical-weapons-attack-was-staged-islamic-jihadi

    The government lies to us all the time - they've lied to us over global warming, ahem man made climate change, they've lied to us about the future security of our food supplies, they've lied to us over the Panama Papers and Paradise Papers and covered up the fraud, theft and money laundering operations that many MP's and members of the House of Lords are linked to (documented fact via prima facie companies house evidence), they've lied to us the reason they got involved in Syria in the first place (in order to get gas and oil pipelines built through there from Qatar in order to reduce European dependence on Russian energy), they've lied to us about what they're doing to the NHS and they've lied to us about covering up historic child sexual abuse linked to Westminster (just have a look at the Exaro News directors apart from Mark Watts and where their fellow directorships and associated directors leads for starters).

    With a record like that, the government is the last thing I would ever trust. And a lot of the general population over the coming years are going to come to the hard realisation that you cannot trust the government, just as Eastern Europe and Russia found out the hard way with the collapse of communism in the late 1980's and early 1990's.

    You don't know what prima facie means (though admittedly that is the least of your problems).
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 13,219
    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something....I might be wrong, but I don’t even think that quote is on guido.
    To be fair, The Labour Party is correct. May is not likely to act without knowing what the US is planning to do, so it is a concise summary of the Government's position.
    And how would Corbyn act in these circumstances and if the US and France and other allies decide to take action
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 29,695
    edited April 13
    hunchman said:

    Well what a fascinating day! The government's carefully constructed propaganda over the Syrian alleged chemicals weapon attack is now falling apart rapidly at the seams:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-13/russia-has-irrefutable-evidence-uk-staged-syrian-chemical-attack

    and the wonderful former UK ambassador to Syria, Peter Ford, says the same thing:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-11/former-uk-ambassador-syria-syrian-chemical-weapons-attack-was-staged-islamic-jihadi

    The government lies to us all the time - they've lied to us over global warming, ahem man made climate change, they've lied to us about the future security of our food supplies, they've lied to us over the Panama Papers and Paradise Papers and covered up the fraud, theft and money laundering operations that many MP's and members of the House of Lords are linked to (documented fact via prima facie companies house evidence), they've lied to us the reason they got involved in Syria in the first place (in order to get gas and oil pipelines built through there from Qatar in order to reduce European dependence on Russian energy), they've lied to us about what they're doing to the NHS and they've lied to us about covering up historic child sexual abuse linked to Westminster (just have a look at the Exaro News directors apart from Mark Watts and where their fellow directorships and associated directors leads for starters).

    With a record like that, the government is the last thing I would ever trust. And a lot of the general population over the coming years are going to come to the hard realisation that you cannot trust the government, just as Eastern Europe and Russia found out the hard way with the collapse of communism in the late 1980's and early 1990's.

    First, are you saying we have the same type of trustworthy government as an eastern european communist dictatorship? If they are so amazing as to have managed that without the general populace noticing, why are they so incompetent that it all falls apart so easily?

    Second - why is it that we cannot trust our government about anything, but if another government says something it can be taken at face value?

    You cannot have it both ways, hunchman. If the government is as amazingly controlling and nefarious as you claim - and successful at it - why are they so easily found out by you all the time?
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 3,030

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something....I might be wrong, but I don’t even think that quote is on guido.
    To be fair, The Labour Party is correct. May is not likely to act without knowing what the US is planning to do, so it is a concise summary of the Government's position.
    And how would Corbyn act in these circumstances and if the US and France and other allies decide to take action
    He would be like Switzerland , stay the hell out of it.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 27,547
    Worrying development,

    Israel claims an unmanned Iranian drone was armed with explosives to attack Israel

    Israel's military has said the aircraft it shot down in February was on its way to attack Israel.

    Following an "operational and intelligence-based investigation" the military has concluded the "Iranian aircraft was armed with explosives and was tasked to attack Israeli territory", it said.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 13,219
    Yorkcity said:

    Foxy said:

    Sandpit said:

    RobD said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    You asking that is pretty ironic given you often fail to link to articles that you quote. :p
    His source is Order Order

    AGAIN!!!

    This is the new Guido:
    Fake news...or something....I might be wrong, but I don’t even think that quote is on guido.
    To be fair, The Labour Party is correct. May is not likely to act without knowing what the US is planning to do, so it is a concise summary of the Government's position.
    And how would Corbyn act in these circumstances and if the US and France and other allies decide to take action
    He would be like Switzerland , stay the hell out of it.
    We are not a neutral country
  • AndrewAndrew Posts: 719
    edited April 13

    Russia even tried to blame the white helmets for the attack today and at the same time said there was no attack.

    Yes, it's curious how the Russian story has developed .....

    Yesterday: was no attack, our people on the ground have tested, total fake news
    Today: There was a chemical attack, but the British did it.

    It's almost as if they're making up any old BS day by day.
  • nielhnielh Posts: 1,052

    nielh said:

    Sandpit said:

    Foxy said:

    It is all part of May's "Hostile Environment" for immigrants. Enoch would be proud, he specifically mentioned Commonwealth Doctors returning to their original nation.
    SNIP SNIP SNIP
    I know people who have been put back straight back on planes when landing in the US because they have played fast and loose with their visas.
    To look at it another way: why are the home office spending tens of thousand pounds going through the courts trying to deport this guy, when we have just spent money training him to do a job in the NHS (GP) where there is an enormous skill shortage?

    Its just a total waste of money. He should just be given the opportunity of regularising his situation.
    Well that is what I said in the original post, but I was just pointing out again that people seem to think that uk visa rules are optional / don’t apply to them and then get a shock when having broken them they get a negative outcome and then guardian publishes a soft soap piece about it breezing over that they broke the rules.
    Isn't the real point though that this is an absurd and ridiculous area of public policy?

    You have the Government going around deporting vulnerable people who have been here for 40 years, and who probably have every moral right to be here, yet they don't have the paperwork. It's only the guardian that report on it. Thats one of the reasons why I am a guardian 'supporter'.

    Whenever it comes up on PB, the poor person involved is inevitably cast as a liar with something to hide, with the guardian only telling 'one side of the story', yet of course the PB commentariat show no actual inclination to look in to what is really going on or find out the truth.

    As for this guys case, people in the 20's are often late in sorting paperwork out. It happens to us all. It shouldn't be a big deal. Its a life lesson, not a ground to haul someone through the courts to deport them. The Home office bureaucracy has gone rogue and needs to be set straight.
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 3,030
    kle4 said:

    Foxy said:

    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
    Jezza has stated that he is not a Pacifist, he has stated that war should be the last resort, and in support of the United Nations.

    So no action is legitimate unless everyone with a security council veto is in agreement (or at least assents)? Doesn't that rather suggest that any of the veto holding members could act with impunity and he would never support taking action against them? Any of them? We should start invading places.

    In all seriousness though, the UN is not a perfect organisation, are there never situations in which they cannot be the avenue taken? UN members don't subcontract all foreign and military affairs to the UN.
    You can not have it both ways as many do .They called the Iraq war illegal because of the UN.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 5,521
    kle4 said:

    hunchman said:

    Well what a fascinating day! The government's carefully constructed propaganda over the Syrian alleged chemicals weapon attack is now falling apart rapidly at the seams:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-13/russia-has-irrefutable-evidence-uk-staged-syrian-chemical-attack

    and the wonderful former UK ambassador to Syria, Peter Ford, says the same thing:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-11/former-uk-ambassador-syria-syrian-chemical-weapons-attack-was-staged-islamic-jihadi

    The government lies to us all the time - they've lied to us over global warming, ahem man made climate change, they've lied to us about the future security of our food supplies, they've lied to us over the Panama Papers and Paradise Papers and covered up the fraud, theft and money laundering operations that many MP's and members of the House of Lords are linked to (documented fact via prima facie companies house evidence), they've lied to us the reason they got involved in Syria in the first place (in order to get gas and oil pipelines built through there from Qatar in order to reduce European dependence on Russian energy), they've lied to us about what they're doing to the NHS and they've lied to us about covering up historic child sexual abuse linked to Westminster (just have a look at the Exaro News directors apart from Mark Watts and where their fellow directorships and associated directors leads for starters).

    With a record like that, the government is the last thing I would ever trust. And a lot of the general population over the coming years are going to come to the hard realisation that you cannot trust the government, just as Eastern Europe and Russia found out the hard way with the collapse of communism in the late 1980's and early 1990's.

    First, are you saying we have the same type of trustworthy government as an eastern european communist dictatorship? If they are so amazing as to have managed that without the general populace noticing, why are they so incompetent that it all falls apart so easily?

    Second - why is it that we cannot trust our government about anything, but if another government says something it can be taken at face value?

    You cannot have it both ways, hunchman. If the government is as amazingly controlling and nefarious as you claim - and successful at it - why are they so easily found out by you all the time?
    He trusts Zero hedge - that really is all you need to know
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 9,632
    Floater said:

    Floater said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    Afghanistan? why the feck would anyone have been against Afghanistan?

    Of course the Americans with Labours help fecked it up by going into Iraq on a lie
    I bet you supported all 3 though.

    And I bet you believed the WMD row
    Were you against Afghanistan?

    You a troofer ?

    Reading your crap I could believe it.
    So you supported all 3 thought so.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 29,695
    kle4 said:

    hunchman said:

    Well what a fascinating day! The government's carefully constructed propaganda over the Syrian alleged chemicals weapon attack is now falling apart rapidly at the seams:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-13/russia-has-irrefutable-evidence-uk-staged-syrian-chemical-attack

    and the wonderful former UK ambassador to Syria, Peter Ford, says the same thing:

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-04-11/former-uk-ambassador-syria-syrian-chemical-weapons-attack-was-staged-islamic-jihadi

    T's.

    First, are you saying we have the same type of trustworthy government as an eastern european communist dictatorship? If they are so amazing as to have managed that without the general populace noticing, why are they so incompetent that it all falls apart so easily?

    Second - why is it that we cannot trust our government about anything, but if another government says something it can be taken at face value?

    You cannot have it both ways, hunchman. If the government is as amazingly controlling and nefarious as you claim - and successful at it - why are they so easily found out by you all the time?
    Edit - I mean seriously, with all the crimes you allege of so many people, very serious crimes, why in the f**k would our all powerful puppet masters put easily verifiable proof in this Companies House stuff you are always going on about?

    Your contention is that these people commit every type of corruption known to man, and cover it all up, but put out a breadcrumb of clues for people to dig through.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 29,695
    Yorkcity said:

    kle4 said:

    Foxy said:

    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
    Jezza has stated that he is not a Pacifist, he has stated that war should be the last resort, and in support of the United Nations.

    So no action is legitimate unless everyone with a security council veto is in agreement (or at least assents)? Doesn't that rather suggest that any of the veto holding members could act with impunity and he would never support taking action against them? Any of them? We should start invading places.

    In all seriousness though, the UN is not a perfect organisation, are there never situations in which they cannot be the avenue taken? UN members don't subcontract all foreign and military affairs to the UN.
    You can not have it both ways as many do .They called the Iraq war illegal because of the UN.
    I don't even know what 'illegal war' means. As far as I can tell international law is largely a nonsense, since nations seem to think they can do anything without it being against international law.
  • YorkcityYorkcity Posts: 3,030
    kle4 said:

    Yorkcity said:

    kle4 said:

    Foxy said:

    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
    Jezza has stated that he is not a Pacifist, he has stated that war should be the last resort, and in support of the United Nations.

    So no action is legitimate unless everyone with a security council veto is in agreement (or at least assents)? Doesn't that rather suggest that any of the veto holding members could act with impunity and he would never support taking action against them? Any of them? We should start invading places.

    In all seriousness though, the UN is not a perfect organisation, are there never situations in which they cannot be the avenue taken? UN members don't subcontract all foreign and military affairs to the UN.
    You can not have it both ways as many do .They called the Iraq war illegal because of the UN.
    I don't even know what 'illegal war' means. As far as I can tell international law is largely a nonsense, since nations seem to think they can do anything without it being against international law.
    Totally agree .
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 1,818
    Floater said:

    Foxy said:

    JackW said:

    Floater said:

    The UK government is "waiting for instructions" from Donald Trump about whether to launch a missile strike on Syria, Jeremy Corbyn has said.

    Where as you are waiting for Putin's?

    Source!!
    Clown - that has been all over the news all day
    What does !! mean.

    You must be getting really frustrated no missiles have been launched yet.

    When did you last oppose military action.

    Libya? Iraq? Afghanistan?
    The question for Jezza and co :

    Is your irrevocable default position that military action is never to be contemplated.

    If we are to have a pacifist as LotO then Jezza should be open about his position, as he is want to advise others to be so.
    Jezza has stated that he is not a Pacifist, he has stated that war should be the last resort, and in support of the United Nations.

    At a push he might have agreed we should have fought in WW2 - but obviously only after Russia was invaded.
    I don't think that he was around at the time, so we do not know. May as a loyal Tory would more than have been an advocate of Appeasement.

    In reality Jezza would have been an active Antifascist, perhaps in Spain.
  • hunchmanhunchman Posts: 2,482
    kle4 said:

    hunchman said:

    Well what a fascinating day!

    First, are you saying we have the same type of trustworthy government as an eastern european communist dictatorship? If they are so amazing as to have managed that without the general populace noticing, why are they so incompetent that it all falls apart so easily?

    Second - why is it that we cannot trust our government about anything, but if another government says something it can be taken at face value?

    You cannot have it both ways, hunchman, if the government is as amazingly controlling and nefarious as you claim, why are they so easily found out all the time?
    I'm saying we have a very untrustworthy government. East Germany with the Stasi was such an example before it fell apart in the late 1980's.

    As for the general population not noticing, I would argue that they are beginning to notice, not as quickly as I would like, granted, but things are starting to move. People generally think that governments are a lot cleverer than they really are. In reality, this government has been incredibly incompetent over Skripal and Syria. On Skripal the story was initially that they weren't going to survive as it was alleged to be military grade Novichok, which it obviously wasn't. They were so incompetent that the poor guinea pigs and the black Persian died through famine and hunger, and obviously didn't search their house......or they did and then had to destroy the pets as they didn't fit in with the official narrative.

    On your second point, Lavrov wouldn't be so stupid as to say there is irrefutable evidence, and then not able to produce the said evidence.

    On your final point, the government are found out a lot of the time because they're thoroughly incompetent, and can't see that more and more people are now seeing past their outrageous and disgusting lies on so many matters, with horrible consequences for many people, not least the poor oppressed people in Syria.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 6,434
    edited April 13
    Sandpit said:

    Here we go, sneaked out late on Friday afternoon by the EU: all aviation agreements to be torn up on Brexit day - including air operators’ licences, aircraft registrations, licences for pilots, dispatchers, engineers, air traffic controllers etc etc.

    https://www.easa.europa.eu/brexit-negotiations

    "NOTICE TO STAKEHOLDERS - WITHDRAWAL OF THE UNITED KINGDOM AND EU AVIATION SAFETY RULES" on the European Commission website, which says:

    Certificates issued before the withdrawal date by the competent authorities of the United Kingdom on the basis of the provisions of the Basic Regulation and its implementing rules will no longer be valid as of the withdrawal date in the EU. This concerns in particular:
     Certificates of airworthiness, restricted certificates of airworthiness, permits to fly, approvals of organisations responsible for the maintenance of products, parts and appliances, approvals for organisations responsible for the manufacture of products, parts and appliances, approvals for maintenance training organisations, and certificates for personnel responsible for the release of a product, part or appliance after maintenance, issued pursuant to Article 5 of the Basic Regulation;
     Pilot licences, pilot medical certificates, certificates for pilot training organisations, certificates for aero-medical centres, certificates for flight simulation training devices, certificates for persons responsible for providing flight training, flight simulation training or assessing pilots' skill, and certificates for aero medical examiners, issued pursuant to Article 7 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for air operators and attestations for the cabin crew, issued pursuant to Article 8 of the Basic Regulation;
     Certificates for aerodromes, certificates for ATM/ANS providers, licences and medical certificates for air traffic controllers, certificates for air traffic controller training organisations, certificates for aero medical centres and aero medical examiners responsible for air traffic controllers, certificates for persons
    etc

    In this case, it's a statement of legal fact. The above certificates are invalidated when the UK withdraws from the treaties that give them legal effect.
This discussion has been closed.