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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » It has been working class voters who have been the main dri

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  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited May 2013
    Blue_rog said:

    I wonder that if UKiP takes votes from all the electoral strata it should be regarded more of a centrist party rather than left or right wing.

    That's a very sage point re attitudes re the disenfranchised. There is very clearly a bloc of voters that aren't Left or Right but are socially conservative and feeling under attack but aren't part of the Respect agenda - but are the polar opposite re cultural sympathies.

    It's fascinating stuff unpicking L or R or religion or values or patriotism or fellow feeling with another et al.

    UK politics is messier now than anytime I've lived through re who we are and want to be. The 70s were a single ideological battle between the West and the East re capitalism vs socialism. We're in a very different place nowadays.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 15,861
    Speaking of the Guardian

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/timstanley/100214938/revealed-the-five-loopiest-guardian-articles-of-all-time/

    1. Take time out of your day to hug a p d o file..
    2. Conservatives are morons
    3. Communism wasn’t all bad
    4. Public enjoyment at the Diamond Jubilee reminded us that the Brits are dirt-munching, cap-doffing serfs.
    5. North Korea is the victim of press bias
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Communism wasn’t all bad"

    It self-evidently couldn't have been ALL bad, otherwise Russian life expectancy wouldn't have fallen through the floor after the collapse of communism. Cuba has literacy and life expectancy figures that other comparable countries can only dream of.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948

    If PC or SNP become national then they can be considered in the same league

    The Welsh are being disobliging - they agree with the separate Separatists north of the border who think a Separate Scotland should have a separate currency:

    Welsh FM tells George Osborne: Don't give Scots the pound
    The Welsh First Minister has pleaded with the Chancellor not to risk his country’s economy by allowing an independent Scotland to share the pound

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/10031238/Welsh-FM-tells-George-Osborne-Dont-give-Scots-the-pound.html
  • samsam Posts: 727
    edited May 2013
    Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance but why would I care?
  • tarletontarleton Posts: 18
    MIKE K ...well you're probably right , I naturally don't have a high regard for a group of pre Thatcher era, Labour luddites still ' ' waiting for the boat to come in ''...those folks are like a bunch of good natured , affable munchkins following Labour's yellow brick road ...don't expect anything revolutionary from them ...most of those folks have never even heard of UKIP
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Thats because you "don't understand Scotland" and will "rue the day" you dared comment on Scotland."

    Nah, it's because he's a troll.
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance by why would I care?"

    Why would we care whether you care?
  • DoubleCarpetDoubleCarpet Posts: 184
    Trust you had a good walk!

    Turnout figures on election days are normally the province of countries with an Interior Ministry - the likes of France, Italy, Spain etc.

    Anyway - hopeful of winning my bet on UKIP seats now.
    MikeK said:

    Hallo all. Back from a Kew Garden excursion and now ready for the news and all the gossip.

    Does anyone know what percentage of eligible voters, voted by 15:00hrs?

  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    It's fascinating that even the "serial labour voters" still don't realise that all the inept PR spin in the world isn't going to make the locals any less amusing. I fear the idiot fans of the nasty party master strategy of banging on about welfare, immigration and Europe are going to be in for a rough ride. What a shame. ;^)
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948

    "Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance by why would I care?"

    Why would we care whether you care?

    From the amount of repetitive posting you do one might think you might....industrious and stupid?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 15,753

    "oh really James you just emphasis your ignorance, Mr Nesbitt is from Strangford, Dungannon was until recently Martin McGuinness country."

    Are things so desperate at UUP headquarters that Mr Nesbitt can't afford the train fare to go get his photo taken with his party's candidates in other parts of the province?

    No I think they're too busy laughing at how badly the various nationalists are handling their cases. First the Irish ones and now the Scottish ones. What's the point of a Unionist party when the Nats do the job for you ?
  • samsam Posts: 727
    edited May 2013

    "Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance by why would I care?"

    Why would we care whether you care?

    Alright touchy!

    Just wondered why would it bother any Englishman if Scotland were independent? I personally couldnt care less

  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "The Welsh are being disobliging"

    As a matter of interest, Carlotta, if you believe "the Welsh" is an acceptable shorthand for "the Labour government in Wales", does that mean it's OK to use "the Scots" as shorthand for "the SNP government in Scotland"?

    Thanks in advance.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 17,008
    @Socrates It wouldn't be put in those terms, of course. The Prime Minister's office would let it be known that it would have serious concerns about the legality of including Nigel Farage and excluding the Greens, the SNP and Plaid Cymru, and that a debate with all of those figures would be unmanageable.

    And the Prime Minister's office would be right as well.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Fascinating as Mr Spock would say - hmmm...

    "The report states that the UK government and police, excluding court orders for defamation and copyright infringement, made 124 requests to remove videos and advertisements on Google's Adword platform.

    Most involved the removal of YouTube videos that were deemed by the government to infringe national security and hate speech laws, with more than half of the requests rejected by Google.

    Keen to present itself as a company that stands up for the rights of its users against governments, Google highlights a number of cases where they refused to remove content or hand over data, including a YouTube video that allegedly showed racist behaviour by a local police force in the UK, reported by the Telegraph earlier this year.

    Google also said that in the first six months of 2012, the number of requests for the removal of content had increased by 98% compared with the same period in the previous year..." http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/google/10032977/UK-government-demanded-removal-of-124-YouTube-videos.html
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948
    sam said:

    "Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance by why would I care?"

    Why would we care whether you care?

    Alright touchy!

    Just wondered why would it bother any Englishman if Scotland were independent? I personally couldnt care less
    IIRC recent polling showed the English were keener on Scots separation than the Scots....

  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 15,753
    sam said:

    "Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance by why would I care?"

    Why would we care whether you care?

    Alright touchy!

    Just wondered why would it bother any Englishman if Scotland were independent? I personally couldnt care less

    so shouldn't you be in EIP not UKIP ?
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "From the amount of repetitive posting you do"

    I hope you've deleted the evidence of your immaculately non-repetitive posts about Chris Huhne and "sixteen months".
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    Farage is being disobliging to the leader of the nasty party.
    Nigel Farage ‏@Nigel_Farage

    Another brittle pledge by Cameron which we won't be falling for. http://fb.me/2kXx6Ja0y

    I wonder why?
    White Wednesday ‏@WhiteWednesday

    "He marched them up to the top of the hill & he marched them down again." Cameron's convolutions on Europe. http://specc.ie/10uyF5v #UKIP
    Just how gullible are tory eurosceptic MPs?

    *chortle*

  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 15,861
    God bless Gordon Brown and his handling of the banks

    Faisal Islam ‏@faisalislam 26m

    Fave Interest only stat, buried in FSA stats: Q1 '08, the majority of new mortgages across UK (50.42%) were interest only. 56% incl combined
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "No I think they're too busy laughing at how badly the various nationalists are handling their cases."

    Er yes, a majority SNP government and the referendum that you guys have fought for generations to prevent happening is...a real blow to the nationalist cause. I weep myself to sleep every night, as I'm sure you can imagine.
  • samsam Posts: 727

    sam said:

    "Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance by why would I care?"

    Why would we care whether you care?

    Alright touchy!

    Just wondered why would it bother any Englishman if Scotland were independent? I personally couldnt care less

    so shouldn't you be in EIP not UKIP ?
    Possibly!

    I dont care either way. If they want to go it alone, I say let them... Bugs me being called British anyway Im not Welsh, Scottish or Irish, Im English

  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Some amusing tweets picked up from Labour:

    Paul Richards
    @Labourpaul
    I've been reassigned to a polling station that has UKIP tellers. *shudder*

    Jason Walter ‏@Decados
    @Labourpaul stay strong. You can do it.

    A Better Tomorrow ‏@Bestoftherest3
    @Labourpaul Make sure you have your garlic and wooden stakes to hand.
    ----------------------------------
    I'm glad that they see the lighter side of today's elections, but are we kippers so scary?



  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 15,753
    tim said:

    Mick_Pork said:

    It's fascinating that even the "serial labour voters" still don't realise that all the inept PR spin in the world isn't going to make the locals any less amusing. I fear the idiot fans of the nasty party master strategy of banging on about welfare, immigration and Europe are going to be in for a rough ride. What a shame. ;^)

    Shall we have a sweep on who is the first one to say that following the UKIP surge Cameron needs to make more speeches on Europe and immigration, toughening up his stance.

    tim why would anyone bet on that, we all know it's going to be you.
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "IIRC recent polling showed the English were keener on Scots separation than the Scots...."

    Wouldn't be difficult, because as I've explained to you a number of times Carlotta "separation" has zero support in Scotland. Independence, on the other hand, is growing steadily in popularity.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 15,753

    "No I think they're too busy laughing at how badly the various nationalists are handling their cases."

    Er yes, a majority SNP government and the referendum that you guys have fought for generations to prevent happening is...a real blow to the nationalist cause. I weep myself to sleep every night, as I'm sure you can imagine.

    What's the currency today Jim ?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 15,861

    "No I think they're too busy laughing at how badly the various nationalists are handling their cases."

    Er yes, a majority SNP government and the referendum that you guys have fought for generations to prevent happening is...a real blow to the nationalist cause. I weep myself to sleep every night, as I'm sure you can imagine.

    I've yet to see you praise David Cameron for enabling a referendum.

    All those generations of waiting and you couldn't come up with even a half baked currency policy - laughable.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 11,616

    "I never said England is Britain."

    No, you just said that the sole determinant of whether a party has representation in UK election debates should be whether they stand candidates in England, which is...er, something entirely different.

    No. I said they stand in over 97% of constituencies and the <3% they don't are the statistically insignificant exception and not the norm.

    English constituencies - 533
    97% of constituencies - 631

    Maths clue: Its not possible to reach 97% from 533 alone.

    I said that the local exceptions which are covered by local media should have their local issues discussed by that local media. The national news should discuss that which affects the bulk of the nation.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948

    "IIRC recent polling showed the English were keener on Scots separation than the Scots...."

    Wouldn't be difficult, because as I've explained to you a number of times Carlotta "separation" has zero support in Scotland. Independence, on the other hand, is growing steadily in popularity.

    And at that rate should surpass support for the Union....about 2028?

    Pity the referendum is next year.....

    What's your view on a separate Scotland's currency btw? Which of the separatists do you support?

  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "I've yet to see you praise David Cameron for enabling a referendum."

    He didn't. if he hadn't backed down on his posturing in early 2012, the SNP would simply have gone ahead and held a consultative referendum.
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "What's the currency today Jim ?"

    Liberty and self-determination is our currency, Alan. Today and every other day.
  • NeilNeil Posts: 7,983

    UKIP sign theft caught on camera.

    I bet it turns out to be a Labour activist seeing as they have most to fear from UKIP ;)
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948

    "I've yet to see you praise David Cameron for enabling a referendum."

    He didn't. if he hadn't backed down on his posturing in early 2012, the SNP would simply have gone ahead and held a consultative referendum.

    Tell us again about Eck's victory in getting the DevoMax question included....oh......

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2086833/Scottish-independence-More-English-Scots-want-independence-Scotland.html
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 15,861

    "I've yet to see you praise David Cameron for enabling a referendum."

    He didn't. if he hadn't backed down on his posturing in early 2012, the SNP would simply have gone ahead and held a consultative referendum.

    So why bother talking to Cameron ? Laughable.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Awww @JamesKelly - I see you are continuing with your campaign to Disagree with everything I post even when I simply quote the opinions of others like Peter Kellner.

    How long are you going to maintain this - its been a week or so already - but you've missed a few so that's a blackmark for you, not me since I find it amusing - but you don't.

    Every time you Disagree with a post of mine is a sign that you're losing to me because you're bothered enough to do it. Yours are of no consequence to me at all.

    Have a nice day.
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "What's your view on a separate Scotland's currency btw? Which of the separatists do you support?"

    I oppose a separate Scotland, and I therefore have no interest in whether a separate Scotland should have a separate currency. I vehemently oppose the political views of all separatists, and not just Michael Gove.

    On the other hand I am passionately in favour of independence for Scotland, and I think that an independent Scotland should remain part of the sterling-zone.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 15,753

    "What's the currency today Jim ?"

    Liberty and self-determination is our currency, Alan. Today and every other day.

    Is that why you put off having a vote for so long ?
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 11,616
    sam said:

    "Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance by why would I care?"

    Why would we care whether you care?

    Alright touchy!

    Just wondered why would it bother any Englishman if Scotland were independent? I personally couldnt care less

    Because Scotland has far too much power and relevance to the UK right now. If we were rid of Scotland a generation ago then no Gordon Brown, no 40 Labour MPs etc

    The amount of media attention that one tiny region gets compared to other regions. James Kelly seems to think he's hard done by as Scotland's not treated equivalent to England, but Scotland shouldn't even be treated as equivalent to North West England.

    Here in the North West we have over 7 mn people (including far too many that vote Labour unfortunately). Almost 50% more than Scotland as a whole. You want to do like-for-like comparisons, see whether there's more Scotland-only or North-West-only coverage. That's a reasonable comparison.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    CALLING @MorrisDancer

    BBC Question Time @bbcquestiontime
    Tonight at 10.35pm, @JustineGreening, @HarrietHarman, Shirley Williams, @VictoriaCoren and David Starkey will be with David D for #bbcqt
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 15,753

    "What's your view on a separate Scotland's currency btw? Which of the separatists do you support?"

    I oppose a separate Scotland, and I therefore have no interest in whether a separate Scotland should have a separate currency. I vehemently oppose the political views of all separatists, and not just Michael Gove.

    On the other hand I am passionately in favour of independence for Scotland, and I think that an independent Scotland should remain part of the sterling-zone.

    yeah but a few years back you were saying should be the Euro. Why not McDonald vouchers, at least it's got a scottish feel to it ?
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 11,616
    edited May 2013

    "What's the currency today Jim ?"

    Liberty and self-determination is our currency, Alan. Today and every other day.

    Is that why you put off having a vote for so long ?
    Be fair to the poor guys, they've only been in power for 6 years without a vote so far.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 15,861
    Plato said:

    CALLING @MorrisDancer

    BBC Question Time @bbcquestiontime
    Tonight at 10.35pm, @JustineGreening, @HarrietHarman, Shirley Williams, @VictoriaCoren and David Starkey will be with David D for #bbcqt


    Jeez - is Dame Shirley still alive ?
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    edited May 2013
    "but you've missed a few so that's a blackmark for you"

    I haven't "missed a few". I only press disagree when I disagree with your post, or find the way that it is written objectionable. If I haven't disagreed with a post, you may safely conclude that neither of those things apply, or that I'm not on the site.

    I'm on the libertarian left, so it's not really a surprise that I occasionally find common ground with someone on the libertarian right. What's more surprising is that it doesn't happen more often - which may indicate that you're libertarian more in self-image than in thought.

    "Yours are of no consequence to me at all."

    Which would presumably explain why every other comment from you at the moment is "boo hoo hoo, James Kelly has disagreed with me again". Plato, my love, I promise that I don't want to be "of consequence" to you. I just want to express my disagreement with you. That, I believe, is the generally-accepted function of a disagree button. Try not to let it upset you so much.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    LOL

    chris g @chrisg0000
    @bbcquestiontime @JustineGreening @HarrietHarman @VictoriaCoren Producers with sense of humour Starkey surrounded by 'silly women'. #popcorn
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited May 2013

    yeah but a few years back you were saying should be the Euro.

    Lord Heseltine says UK will join the euro

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-17742675
    Bodes well for the inevitable tory split on Europe. ;)

    LOL

  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Is that why you put off having a vote for so long ?"

    We didn't. This is the first opportunity we've had to hold one, after decades of you guys blocking it.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948
    edited May 2013

    I think that an independent Scotland should remain part of the sterling-zone.

    Was that before, during and after SNP policy was to join the EuroZone?

    Or just before & after?

    Should Canavan be separated from the Yes Scotland campaign?

    Do you have a penchant for unstable Currency Unions without fiscal transfers?

    Have you sought professional help?

  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 15,861

    "What's your view on a separate Scotland's currency btw? Which of the separatists do you support?"

    On the other hand I am passionately in favour of independence for Scotland, and I think that an independent Scotland should remain part of the sterling-zone.

    Well Panama uses the dollar so it's not unheard of...

    List of dollarised countries - some crackers in there that you will join:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dollarization

    You will be the first country to be dollarised to sterling - should be an interesting experiment.
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Have you sought professional help?"

    Well, I rang the pest control people, but so far it doesn't seem to be working.
  • samsam Posts: 727
    edited May 2013

    sam said:

    "Is English person all that bothered about whether Scotland is part of the UK ot not? Excuse my ignorance by why would I care?"

    Why would we care whether you care?

    Alright touchy!

    Just wondered why would it bother any Englishman if Scotland were independent? I personally couldnt care less

    Because Scotland has far too much power and relevance to the UK right now. If we were rid of Scotland a generation ago then no Gordon Brown, no 40 Labour MPs etc

    The amount of media attention that one tiny region gets compared to other regions. James Kelly seems to think he's hard done by as Scotland's not treated equivalent to England, but Scotland shouldn't even be treated as equivalent to North West England.

    Here in the North West we have over 7 mn people (including far too many that vote Labour unfortunately). Almost 50% more than Scotland as a whole. You want to do like-for-like comparisons, see whether there's more Scotland-only or North-West-only coverage. That's a reasonable comparison.
    If they want to, go let them. Shouldnt think anyone English cares much. Dont get me wrong, I quite like Scotland, as much as I do any other country.

    Same goes for Gibraltar, The Falklands, Wales whatever...

    Does any English person not have a bit of a soft spot for Eire just as much as Wales, N Ireland or Scotland?

    In terms of International Football, I always want England to win... when Scotland, Wales, NI & Eire play each other I dont mind who wins, and if they play anyone else I want them to win





  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948
    Plato said:

    CALLING @MorrisDancer

    BBC Question Time @bbcquestiontime
    Tonight at 10.35pm, @JustineGreening, @HarrietHarman, Shirley Williams, @VictoriaCoren and David Starkey will be with David D for #bbcqt

    I see wee Jimmy Kelly is continuing his childish pranks.....Starkey can be guaranteed to upset someone....

  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Plato said:

    CALLING @MorrisDancer

    BBC Question Time @bbcquestiontime
    Tonight at 10.35pm, @JustineGreening, @HarrietHarman, Shirley Williams, @VictoriaCoren and David Starkey will be with David D for #bbcqt

    This is making me LOL - @JamesKelly is now obsessively pressing the Disagree button when I post the panellists of QT so that he can claim to Disagree with everything I ever post.

    Hilarious bait taking.

    Do keep it up. I can play this game when bored forever - the key is that I can drop it when I'm bored from one minute to the next as I don't care and have zero to prove. He on the other-hand does so is already dancing to my tune until he gives in.

    I win no matter what. Write a blog being checkmated...
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    This is perfect - just perfect

    Daleks need to use the loos in Paddington as well

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948
    Mick_Pork said:

    Lord Heseltine says UK will join the euro

    Lord Heseltine to the Tories

    Canavan to 'Yes Scotland'

    Discuss.

    "Unless Canavan and his non-SNP colleagues recant, or Salmond changes tack, it will be impossible for Yes Scotland to line up behind Salmond on his currency and monetary policy – including the vexed issue of relying on a "foreign" central bank in London - in next year's referendum campaign."

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/scottish-independence-blog/2013/may/01/scottish-independence-currency-conflict
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948
    Plato said:

    Plato said:

    CALLING @MorrisDancer

    BBC Question Time @bbcquestiontime
    Tonight at 10.35pm, @JustineGreening, @HarrietHarman, Shirley Williams, @VictoriaCoren and David Starkey will be with David D for #bbcqt

    Hilarious bait taking.
    There is a 'Troll' button....

  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 15,861
    edited May 2013
    Pork thinks Hezza is some sort of influence in the Tory party ? Laughable.

  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 38,364
    That looks like a potentially excellent lineup on QT.

    Victoria Coren is rather lovely.
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    Plato -

    "as I don't care and have zero to prove"

    Yes, we can tell how little you care from this, your seventy-ninth post saying exactly the same thing. If it's bothering you so much, it might be an idea to contact Vanilla - they may have a helpful guide on the function of the disagree button,
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724

    That looks like a potentially excellent lineup on QT.

    Victoria Coren is rather lovely.

    I'm not overly keen on Ms Coren - but can see your point - she's quite feisty like Ms Greening. There aren't any men that ever get my pulse rate up in that context on QT :^ (
  • samsam Posts: 727

    That looks like a potentially excellent lineup on QT.

    Victoria Coren is rather lovely.

    Three leftys and two righties, but Starkey counts double, so three all

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948
    TGOHF said:

    Pork thinks Hezza is some sort of influence in the Tory party ? Laughable.

    Anyone would think he's an out of touch separatist who thinks he's going to win a referendum....oh....hang out.....

  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Somebody's auctioning an arc of prosperity they found abandoned in a curry house. I'm top bidder at £2.70, do you think that's too much ?"

    Get in there fast, my man! I'd rather be in the Norwegian arc of prosperity than the Osborne Hollow of Despair any day of the week.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530

    Mick_Pork said:

    Lord Heseltine says UK will join the euro

    Lord Heseltine to the Tories

    Canavan to 'Yes Scotland'

    Discuss.
    It's Yes Scotland now is it petal?

    LOL

    Heseltine was a senior minister in the same party as Cammie and supports staying in Europe just like Cammie. You'll be exposed to all the lovely splits in the tory party over Europe soon enough because tory backbench MPs are hardly going to stay quiet forever while Cammie spins more cast iron twaddle that even they struggle to believe.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 20,188
    edited May 2013
    "More than a handful of Tory MPs, including one senior backbencher, privately admit that they’ll vote Ukip in 2014 to try to push their party in a more Eurosceptic direction."

    http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/8901181/ukip-vs-the-world/
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 15,861
    You need 3 points minimum to make an arc James.

    Faroes and Greenland ?

  • sladeslade Posts: 487
    Off topic - an astonishing win for Yorkshire. They won by an innings after Derbyshire got 475 in the first innings. Joe Root continues on the up - 49, 182, and 236 so far. A good bet for 1000 in May?
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Can this be a harbinger of thing to come in the south?:

    http://www.thisiskent.co.uk/POLL-Ukip-winners-Kent-voters/story-18871118-detail/story.html#axzz2S93C51zo

    THE Eurosceptic Ukip movement has brushed aside all opposition to win an exclusive on-line poll conducted by This Is Kent.

    Ukip, which is expected to perform well at today's Kent County Council election, took 56% of the vote with Labour a long way back in second place with 15%.

    The Conservatives, which have held an unassailable majority at county hall since 2009, were polled into third place with just 12%.

    The Liberal Democrats (4%) were edged into fourth behind the Greens on 5%.

    If so, today will be remembered as a tremendous day for UKIP.

  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    Ken Clarke: Ukip has fruitcakes, loonies, waifs and strays

    Minister without portfolio ditches Tory strategy of ignoring Ukip to accuse it of creating 'a ridiculous scare' about Bulgarians and Romanians

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2013/apr/28/ken-clarke-ukip-waifs-strays
    A minister in government with some kind of influence? Laughable indeed.
  • RichardNabaviRichardNabavi Posts: 3,413
    Cyclefree said:
    Yes, that article is a gem. I hope PBers didn't miss it amongst all the Kelly-spamming.

    Frank Field is one of the most impressive of our MPs. I don't think his analysis is necessarily right or practical in every case, but it's always based on what actually happens in reality, rather than just partisan point-scoring. In that way he's quite similar to IDS.

    I particularly liked his can-do attitude on piloting some of his ideas:

    When we meet for coffee in Parliament, he has just finished arranging with his local metropolitan college a pilot of some of the recommendations in his report. Instead of waiting for the government to pick the darned thing up and do something about it, Field is putting his own plans into practice to show ministers that they will work. There are 15 schools – including Eton – signed up to this scheme, which will teach life skills around parenting, friendships and employment to their pupils

    Bravo! That's the way to find out what works and what doesn't.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    antifrank said:

    @Socrates It wouldn't be put in those terms, of course. The Prime Minister's office would let it be known that it would have serious concerns about the legality of including Nigel Farage and excluding the Greens, the SNP and Plaid Cymru, and that a debate with all of those figures would be unmanageable.

    Because if the Prime Minister's office spins something a certain way, the famously pro-Cameron media is bound to loyally report it on the same basis...
  • RicardohosRicardohos Posts: 258
    Can anyone post up the top 5 or so hashtags for getting live results on twitter tonight? Would be much appreciated.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited May 2013
    @JamesKelly

    I see wee dotty lotty is continuing her childish hysteria....the local elections were always bound to upset the tories idiot PR spinners....
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724

    Can anyone post up the top 5 or so hashtags for getting live results on twitter tonight? Would be much appreciated.

    That requires psychic powers - but I'd assume that #LE2013 and #Local2013 would be up there. They were popular last year IIRC
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    That looks like a potentially excellent lineup on QT.

    Victoria Coren is rather lovely.

    Coren is also a very good poker player. She is a looker, but her one failing is a rather raspy voice

  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 38,364
    Mr. K, I'd heard that. Poker was fun to play, but I'd much rather bet on F1. The chance element in poker is excessive.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530

    Can anyone post up the top 5 or so hashtags for getting live results on twitter tonight? Would be much appreciated.

    I'd have thought this one would be among the most prominent.

    #localelections2013
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    I do have a serious soft spot for the out there Kipper candidates - they're like the OMRLP of today in some wards

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BJRjVr5CEAAM2Tp.jpg:large
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 20,188
    "So, why does Farage — a man who wears socks with pound signs on them and Spitfire cufflinks — so terrify the political class? Part of it is that he deliberately doesn’t play by their rules. Indeed, out on the campaign trail with him this week I was struck by how he seems to think, ‘What would a politician do?’, and then do the opposite. I suspect that any member of the Cabinet or shadow cabinet who fancied a tipple at 11 a.m. would only succumb if they were sure no else was watching. But when the drinks trolley rattled past our seat at 11.08 a.m. (Farage is an unembarrassed first-class traveller) his eyes lit up and he asked for a glass of red. At this point the train staff, who up until then had shown little interest in the party leader in their midst, broke into approving chatter."

    http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/8901181/ukip-vs-the-world/
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 20,188
    What are we getting tonight, apart from South Shields?
  • Plato said:

    I do have a serious soft spot for the out there Kipper candidates - they're like the OMRLP of today in some wards

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BJRjVr5CEAAM2Tp.jpg:large

    Whereas Tories prefer just to make an ass of themselves?

    http://www.muckspreading.com/image.axd?picture=2011/7/ToryDonkey.jpg

  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited May 2013
    I saw this and thought of @southamobserver - and droughts. Are we in for another???

    When a duck literally swims by your window...

    http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02543/potd-flood-duck_2543544k.jpg
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 4,093
    Sorry to have to disappoint you but that is a voodoo poll.


    MikeK said:

    Can this be a harbinger of thing to come in the south?:

    http://www.thisiskent.co.uk/POLL-Ukip-winners-Kent-voters/story-18871118-detail/story.html#axzz2S93C51zo

    THE Eurosceptic Ukip movement has brushed aside all opposition to win an exclusive on-line poll conducted by This Is Kent.

    Ukip, which is expected to perform well at today's Kent County Council election, took 56% of the vote with Labour a long way back in second place with 15%.

    The Conservatives, which have held an unassailable majority at county hall since 2009, were polled into third place with just 12%.

    The Liberal Democrats (4%) were edged into fourth behind the Greens on 5%.

    If so, today will be remembered as a tremendous day for UKIP.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 20,188
    edited May 2013
    The new boundaries for county council divisions have appeared today on the ElectionMaps website:

    http://www.election-maps.co.uk
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948

    Cyclefree said:
    Yes, that article is a gem. I hope PBers didn't miss it amongst all the Kelly-spamming
    Thanks for pointing it out - there is quite a lot of noise to signal today....

    Agree - Field is excellent - he made one of the most thoughtful contributions when Thatcher died - pointing out that none of the parties are addressing the great challenges today in the same way that Thatcher took on the unions.....
  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 2,913
    TGOHF said:

    You need 3 points minimum to make an arc James.

    Faroes and Greenland ?

    Neither are fully independent from Denmark........
  • timmotimmo Posts: 764
    In Surrey voting is brisk with both the Tories and Kippers claiming they are getting their vote out..
  • samsam Posts: 727

    "Is that why you put off having a vote for so long ?"

    We didn't. This is the first opportunity we've had to hold one, after decades of you guys blocking it.

    I reckon we should have a vote on whether to let you go! Youd probably get what you want

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948
    Mick_Pork said:

    @JamesKelly I see wee dotty lotty is continuing her childish hysteria....the local elections were always bound to upset the tories idiot PR spinners....

    Ah! Wee Jimmy Kelly likes you - bless!

    I thought your contribution to the discussion on Scotland's currency as thoughtful and incisive as ever....

  • samsam Posts: 727
    AndyJS said:

    "So, why does Farage — a man who wears socks with pound signs on them and Spitfire cufflinks — so terrify the political class? Part of it is that he deliberately doesn’t play by their rules. Indeed, out on the campaign trail with him this week I was struck by how he seems to think, ‘What would a politician do?’, and then do the opposite. I suspect that any member of the Cabinet or shadow cabinet who fancied a tipple at 11 a.m. would only succumb if they were sure no else was watching. But when the drinks trolley rattled past our seat at 11.08 a.m. (Farage is an unembarrassed first-class traveller) his eyes lit up and he asked for a glass of red. At this point the train staff, who up until then had shown little interest in the party leader in their midst, broke into approving chatter."

    http://www.spectator.co.uk/features/8901181/ukip-vs-the-world/

    Farage makes an excellent point about working class ex Labour voters, basically working class people who think Owen Jones is a dick.

  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 15,753
    sam said:

    "Is that why you put off having a vote for so long ?"

    We didn't. This is the first opportunity we've had to hold one, after decades of you guys blocking it.

    I reckon we should have a vote on whether to let you go! Youd probably get what you want


    yes, but you wouldn't, since the Nats are contrarians they'd refuse to go.
  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    edited May 2013
    "I reckon we should have a vote on whether to let you go!"

    A vote on whether to release others from a hostage situation would not exactly be the model of democracy, but I'd be all in favour of a referendum on English independence.

    Apologies in advance to Richard for more 'Kelly-spamming', ie. another post from a (gasp!) non-Tory.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948

    Sorry to have to disappoint you but that is a voodoo poll.

    Not only that - its a small base voodoo poll - at least the Mail polls have tens of thousands of respondents....this had 300....

  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948
    sam said:

    "Is that why you put off having a vote for so long ?"

    We didn't. This is the first opportunity we've had to hold one, after decades of you guys blocking it.

    I reckon we should have a vote on whether to let you go! Youd probably get what you want
    If not the majority of Scots.....

  • samsam Posts: 727
    edited May 2013

    "I reckon we should have a vote on whether to let you go!"

    A vote on whether to release others from a hostage situation would not exactly be the model of democracy, but I'd be all in favour of a referendum on English independence.

    Apologies in advance to Richard for more 'Kelly-spamming', ie. another post from a (gasp!) non-Tory.

    Haha I was just trying to get a rise out of you, but at the same time I think it would make all sides happy.

    As I first said I dont know why any Englishman would be bothered. We can still be kind of best friends/warring brothers but free to do what we want.



  • JamesKellyJamesKelly Posts: 1,348
    "Wee Jimmy Kelly"

    Awww, you've used my preferred name. You really know the way to a guy's heart, Carlotta.

    Shucks!
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 24,948

    As you wish.

  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    edited May 2013
    This article is a gem. I hope PBers didn't miss it amongst all the "near perfect" and incompetent Cameroonian spinning.

    "The EU Referendum Bill won’t appear in Parliament any time soon

    Given the 100 backbenchers who signed John Baron’s recent letter calling for legislation had timed their missive so that it landed on the PM’s doormat in plenty of time before the Queen’s Speech negotiations, some are excitedly wondering whether this means Her Majesty will announce this Bill next week when she opens Parliament.

    But speaking to Downing Street sources today, I gather that this isn’t any more of a push towards legislation than the hint the PM offered his party when it met recently. Those noises he made then about the benefits of legislation were no different, I’m told, from the radio noises he made yesterday. And while there is an appreciation in Downing Street of the argument that losing the vote on the bill would be of enormous benefit to the Conservatives, the chances of that bill ever making it as far as a vote are made considerably slimmer by the reality of Coalition. A source close to the Prime Minister tells me

    The problem is that the Tories worry that even before a dramatic Commons face-off, the Lib Dems wouldn’t sign off on such a bill. They’re right: Lib Dem sources tell me they wouldn’t allow the legislation through the backroom negotiations, although they appreciate that this is what one calls ‘tummy-tickling’ by the Prime Minister. And they don’t think there’s a way of introducing legislation that part of the government has refused to sign up to, unless this has already been set in stone by the Coalition Agreement. A Lib Dem source says to me:

    ‘If you are going to start saying well the different parties in the Coalition can now bring forward any bills they like, then enjoy the mansion tax and 50p votes. That sort of thing would be of no benefit to either party in the Coalition or to the government.’


    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2013/05/the-eu-referendum-bill-wont-appear-in-parliament-any-time-soon/


    Tickling the tummy of the Eurosceptic MPs. Priceless.
    Cammie really does think they are an easily led bunch of gullible fools. The thing is, since he fooled them on the flounce that wasn't and on his easily wriggled out of Cast Iron/Conditional IN/OUT referendum pledge, he may just be right.
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